шь & щ

[ugly-boy.livejournal.com]

Are шь and щ the same? Also, is this analogy correct:

щ : ш :: тщ : ч

Does the sound "тщ" (presumably as in Mandarin q) exist?

Comments

[yay4pikas.livejournal.com]

тщ : ч

I wouldn't think so -- both щ and ш are 'sh' sounds, while ч is more of a 'ts', but I am not a native speaker, so I'm not 100% sure.

[ugly-boy.livejournal.com]

I've always read that ч = ch, but that could be wrong, since a lot of places say that щ = shch which is completely insane ;).

[xantha.livejournal.com]

ч = cheh

but ц = tseh

[some fonts show ц looking more like ч... my husband the native speaker has even gotten confused by fonts in the past.]

Щ is really more like schyah in practice (though my russian prof taught us shch as well).

[bobthedog.livejournal.com]

How is that insane?

[ugly-boy.livejournal.com]

Well it's not really pronounced as the English sounds "shch" right next to each other. It's more like sy or shy.

[bobthedog.livejournal.com]

It is for me and my family and many people I've known. I've always thought that the pronunciaton you speak of is lazy. But as an adult I accept that it's sound change. Not that I would use it, due to what I was taught at home. But, it seems that students of Russian think that no one at all still pronounces it the more formal way.