философский вопрос

[barbarisotschka.livejournal.com]

Чем отличается действительность от реальности?
В немецком (и в английском) эти слова переводятся одним словом.
Как филолог я не верю в полные синонимы ;).

Спасибо заранее за ответы!
Барбара


What is the diffrence between "deistvitelnost" and "realnost"?
In German they are both translatet as "Wirklichkeit".
Being a linguist I don't believe that complete synonyms exist ;)

Thanks in advance - Barbara.

Comments

[i4ka.livejournal.com]

В немецком тоже два слова: Wirklichkeit und Realität

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

Thank you for your contribution. However, I would love to remind you that the working language in this community is English. It is totally OK to post or comment in Russian, but you are expected to provide translation.

BTW "верить в" requires accusative, not prepositional, therefore "не верю в полные синонимы".

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

You went just ahead of me. Yes, действительность is rather Wirklichkeit.

[besisland.livejournal.com]

“Действительность” is the original Russian word. “Реальность” is the latinism and means the same.

[ex-beshenov.livejournal.com]

Скорее полные синонимы. Просто "реальность" --- явная калька, а "действительность" --- нет.

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

Thank you for your contribution. However, I would love to remind you that the working language in this community is English. It is totally OK to post or comment in Russian, but you are expected to provide translation.

Your evil moderator

[ex-beshenov.livejournal.com]

I was confused since the original message is using Russian.

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

I know, I have already reprimanded the original poster and she supplemented her original post with translation :)

Thank you!

[provocateur-b.livejournal.com]

по мне так смысловые оттенки разные.
действительность - это то, что непосредственно связанно с тобой "окружающая действительность". то что происходит здесь и сейчас.
реальность - просто то, что может быть. где угодно и когда угодно. или когда-то было.
например можно сказать "это нереально", но если сказать "это недействительно", то смысл получается совсем иной. недействительно что-то конкретное, а нереально все что угодно.

[liludalas.livejournal.com]

leaving aside that реальность is derived from latin, and действительность is not, they are almost the same.

The only difference i can see, is that действенность is related both to "to be" and "to do". It has active aspect in addition to the statement of the matter of fact.

While реальность does not have this "active" meaning.

probably it's a bit far-fetched, but we can say in russian:

"действительность этого документа..."

meaning the VALIDITY of this document, that it still has up to date info, that it can be taken into account, that it still ACTS

but if we use реальность instead, these meanings will disappear, as we'll mean only the fact that this document ever exited.


hope that helps )

[liludalas.livejournal.com]

nice typo )

i meant действительность instead of действенность in my second sentence, but this is just another synonym ;)

[la-sincerite.livejournal.com]

действенность is not the synonim of действительность as действенность is the ability to bring results, the synonim of effectiveness, am i right?

[liludalas.livejournal.com]

probably.

i think it's called quasi-synonym..

действенность is close to эффективность but stressing rather the proces

[liludalas.livejournal.com]

sual aspect...

[la-sincerite.livejournal.com]

they are the synonims, but not full as far as i'm concerned. if there can be a lot of different "real'nost", "dejstvitelnost'" is just one. Mmmm, realnost' is a series of conditions and consumptions, dejstvitel'nost' is almost the same with the restriction of their (conditions) accordance to our (physical, social) life. (When we say "surovaja dejstvitel'nost'" we put an stress on specific in this situation restrictions.) And in most cases, real'nost' means the same as dejstvitel'nost' when, other things equal, we mean the equaty of conditions and consumptions.

all this is as i understand the difference. -_-"

[racoonbear.livejournal.com]

"В действительности всё не так, как на самом деле"
I dont know the origin of this sentence buit it sounds funny for me. It related somehow to the topic you discuss here.

[archaicos.livejournal.com]

Всамделишность and взаправдашнесть come to mind...
:)

[la-sincerite.livejournal.com]

it's calles "паронимы" - http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9F%D0%B0%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%BC

[liludalas.livejournal.com]

no, i'm sorry, i don't think so

паронимы is a completely different thing.

действенность и действительность are more than just phonetically similar, they have one ROOT
it's true that one is often used instead of the other, but these words have close meanings, so they are synonyms

[la-sincerite.livejournal.com]

the paronyms often have a common root. moreover, they usually have a common root and differ by only another one morphem.
and in this case, when one is used instead of the other, their meanings are mixed up and this is an error.

[la-sincerite.livejournal.com]

i don't know if you're russian, so i've found one more link - in english - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paronym
the first meaning - that what i try to explain =)

[liludalas.livejournal.com]

i'm afraid my linguistic education is a bit insufficient to argue about the difference between paronyms and synonyms. I know a person more experienced in it though, will ask for his advice.

Anyway, initially my point wasn't about the difference between действенность и действительность
but between действительность и реальность, and i hope i explained my ideas quite clearly.

[la-sincerite.livejournal.com]

yes, as i've understood, you've found one more meaning of the word "dejstvitelnost", more in juristic sense. Here we cannot substitute "dejstvitelnost'" for "real'nost'" - i hope, i understand you correctly

[liludalas.livejournal.com]

yes, i tried to explain the difference between действительность и реальность using another meaning of действительность

because the meaning of the root is important as far as synonyms are concerned

this "collateral" meaning, i think, can if not explain, at lease give some idea of the difference.

I think they are close synonyms, but explaining the difference from my point of view, and my personal opinions is a bit complicated. Not quite fit in the lj context.