I need help with translating some words.

[tinceiri.livejournal.com]

Hello learn_russian,

I have been studying Russian for about two weeks. I've been doing it through the Pimsleur method which has been sufficient for now, but I'm only on Unit 13. One major problem I've had with using these language tapes is that they're pretty imprecise in explaining how I should write words down in an alphabet that's completely foreign to me. That's something that I'm not unfamiliar with; I've studied Japanese a bit, and I know that I need to write this stuff down in its native alphabet.

Now, I have gone ahead and I've studied a bit of the Cyrillic alphabet. The thing is, however, is that I haven't had a lot of practice in writing words down and I've only memorized about half of it. I've been writing down a few words over and over again to get the basic jist of the pronounciation system in Russian, but I don't really know how to reference certain words. The biggest problem that I have is that I don't understand the context in which some of these words are being used.

If it is okay, I would like to request some sort of translation for some of these words. I've tried to look some of them up through a dictionary but when I get multiple results back I'm not sure which ones to use. So, here's a list of words I'd like to request:

1. That's fine/well. (sounds like 'etah earashoh')
   
2. How much? (sounds like 'shkuulskiska')
   
3. your place (sounds like 'oo vas')
   
4. my place (sounds like 'oo min yah')
   
5. today
   
6. tomorrow
   
7. I (as in I am)
   
8. listen (as in a command; sounds like 'shooshitza)
   
9. evening
   
10. What time is it? (sounds like 'katorii chas')
    
11. At what time? (sounds like 'katorum chi soo')
    
12. repeat (as in a command)
    
13. only (sounds like 'toolka')
    
14. now (sounds like 'seechas')
    
15. thank you (sounds like 'picyeba')
    
16. goodbye (sounds like 'dasvedanya')
    
17. rubles (sounds like 'rubli')
    

Once again, I'd like to thank anyone who took the time to read this and who would be willing to help me. I know that some of this is probably painfully basic, but I'd really like to get a head-start on this language and I feel that by writing these words down in their native translation and in the proper context that I'd be able to my foot in the door with this.

Thank you!

Comments

[melsmarsh.livejournal.com]

I have the Pimsleur tapes too and some of these are in the reading manuals that you should have gotten with the tapes. I'm pretty certain several of them are in there.

[tinceiri.livejournal.com]

I don't have the reading manuals, unfortunately.

[melsmarsh.livejournal.com]

PM me with your email address as I am pretty sure I have a PDF version of the reading manuals that I can send to you.

[calibrono.livejournal.com]

1 That's fine/well. - literally "это хорошо/ладно", but we don't use it like that
2 How much? - "сколько"
3 your place - "у тебя"
4 my place - "у меня"
5 today - "сегодня"
6 tomorrow - "завтра"
7 I - "я"
8 listen (as in a command; sounds like 'shooshitza) - "слушаться" ?
9 evening - вечер
10 What time is it? (sounds like 'katorii chas') - "который час"
11 At what time? (sounds like 'katorum chi soo') - "в котором часу"
12 repeat (as in a command) - "повторять" ?
13 only (sounds like 'toolka') - "только"
14 now (sounds like 'seechas') - "сейчас"
15 thank you (sounds like 'picyeba') - "спасибо"
16 goodbye (sounds like 'dasvedanya') - "до свидания"
17 rubles (sounds like 'rubli') - "рубли"

[xameleon-nr.livejournal.com]

i wonder if you need just the words or some examples on how can the be used :)

# That's fine/well. (sounds like 'etah earashoh')
>> Это хорошо

# How much? (sounds like 'shkuulskiska')
>> Сколько? \ Сколько это стоит? \ Сколько с меня? (and more variants depending on the situation)

# your place (sounds like 'oo vas')
sorry, didnt get the context well .. if this means "at your place" then translate this as "у вас"

# my place (sounds like 'oo min yah')
>> у меня

# today
>> сегодня

# tomorrow
>> завтра

# I (as in I am)
>> я (ex. i am in hurry - я спешу)

# listen (as in a command; sounds like 'shooshitza)
>> слушать is to listen (hear), but слушаться is more like 'to obey'

# evening
>> вечер

# What time is it? (sounds like 'katorii chas')
>> который час? (variants: сколько время? сколько времени?)

# At what time? (sounds like 'katorum chi soo')
>> в котором часу? (variants: в какое время, etc)

# repeat (as in a command)
>> повтори (or повторите as a more polite one)

# only (sounds like 'toolka')
>> только

# now (sounds like 'seechas')
>> сейчас

# thank you (sounds like 'picyeba')
>> спасибо

# goodbye (sounds like 'dasvedanya')
>> до свидания

# rubles (sounds like 'rubli')
>> рубли, just as they are :)

[xameleon-nr.livejournal.com]

sorry for number two:

# How much? (sounds like 'shkuulskiska')
>> Сколько? \ Сколько это стоит? \ Сколько с меня? (and more variants depending on the situation)

dont know why did i think about payment :)
read this just as "сколько?"

[icamel.livejournal.com]

variants склолько время/сколько времени are not recommended. what the term - colloquial?

[xameleon-nr.livejournal.com]

>> variants склолько время/сколько времени are not recommended.

omg, i wonder why

[kwai.livejournal.com]

because it sounds like "how much watch?")

[sorok-7.livejournal.com]

usually I said exactly склолько время/сколько времени and nothing else :)

[icamel.livejournal.com]

So what?

Actually it looks like i am a kind of a dinosaur and you are partly right -- который час and сколько времени are treated as equally correct already.

http://www.gramota.ru/spravka/trudnosti/36_68 (in russian with no translation, sorry)

Still сколько время is undoubtedly incorrect anyway.

[sorok-7.livejournal.com]

Сколько время - it's informal speech, which little opposite with official Russian grammar, though it's real living informal speech.

[icamel.livejournal.com]

извените - is also a common mistake which is little opposite with official Russian grammar, though real living informal writing. So what?

[theshapka.livejournal.com]

If you would like to practice reading the Cyrillic alphabet, I have a story from my Russian 101 class written in "fake Russian"--that is, written in English transliterated into Cyrillic, as below. Would you be interested?

"Ванс апон а тайм зер ливд эн олд мэн энд эн олд лэди, ху хэд а сон энд а доттер."

[oryx_and_crake]

If you ask me, that's an extremely bad method. It gives the learners a completely wrong idea about Russian letters and how their pronunciation maps to English sounds.

[theshapka.livejournal.com]

Fair enough.

[zauberer.livejournal.com]

Yet another variant (I tried to give a standard pronounciation for some words in which you heard not all the sounds):

1. That's fine/well. Это хорошо (e-tah ha-ra-sho)
2. How much? Сколько? (skol'-kah)
3. your place. У вас (oo vas)
4. my place. У меня (oo meen-yah)
5. today. Сегодня (see-voh-dnya)
6. tomorrow. Завтра (zav-trah)
7. I (as in I am) Я (ya)
8. listen. Слушаться (sloo-shit-sa)
9. evening. Вечер (veh-chir)
10. What time is it? Который час? (ka-to-rii chas?)
11. At what time? В котором часу? (f ka-to-rum chi-soo?)
12. repeat. To repeat = повторять (pof-toh-ryat')
13. only. Только (tol'-kah)
14. now. Сейчас (see-chas)
15. thank you. Спасибо (spah-see-bo)
16. goodbye. До свидания (da svee-dah-nya)
17. rubles. Рубли (roo-bli)

[jawlenska.livejournal.com]

As far as I remember the speaker says "Рублей". But I miiight be wrong. *__*;;

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

If you ask me, the more I see the results of somebody's struggle with Pimsleur (and you're not the first one here to struggle with it,) the more I understand that it is a completely weird method that (probably) gives the learner a shade of the ability to communicate in a grocery store, but still leaves him/her with no knowledge of the language. Russian phonetics is so far from that in American English -- so you cannot simply throw spoken Russian into learner's ears without a careful explanation of which exact sounds they consist, how those sounds work together in different combinations, and - last but not least - how they are written. The examples you give are a very good prove to that. If you, after two weeks of listening and learning, still hear "спасибо" as "picyeba", "слушайся" as "shooshitza," and "сколько стоит" as "shkuulskiska," and there is no written materials AND careful phonetic instructions to make you understand what kind of sounds you hear and how they are written -- then it is definitely a weird course.

[archaicos.livejournal.com]

Another magic method busted, huh? :)

So, what are the other weird and bad things besides Pimsleur and Rosetta Stone that one should avoid or be very cautious with?

I guess somewhere down in the list should appear:
- 25th frame method
- "learning" while sleeping
:)

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

Why, you can always call a Skilled Shaman with twenty-plus years of experience in the field, to perform a Magic Schariwari with a Tambourine (optionally, with Two Tambourines, for only $499.95.) After three days of magic lent (food, drinks, and sex are totally prohibited, or we cannot guarantee the results,) you wake up a fluent Russian speaker. And writer. Optionally, Expert Level Shariwari for as little as $2,399.95.

it's not necessarily "buyer beware"

[scifigal.livejournal.com]

but just an awareness of various teaching methods. Each tends to prescribe to a pet-method and stick to it. Right now the vogue teaching method is the communicative approach, and just as teachers are espousing the fantastic-ness of it, so were nearly all the other approaches.

though I would personally "buyer beware" of "suggestopedia" which uses baroque music to soften your brain and lower your defenses and thus creating a blah blah blah perfect blah blah learning environment ^_^

I would add hypnotism to the list ^_~

I bought the BYKI deluxe version of Russian, and it's great for me, because I needed an interactive flashcard program, which it essentially is. It's perfect for my needs, but I also have tutors and what not. But for someone who thinks it's a magic learning device--not so much.

[mortimer-ford.livejournal.com]

I have not had these problems with Pimsleur. Probably some, yes, but it helps to have reference materials at hand where you can find the correct spelling. Together, I think the two work great. If there is one complaint I have about Pimsleur, it is that it trains you to speak and not listen. I can form my own words much quicker than I can comprehend another's.

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

>materials at hand where you can find the correct spelling

That is indeed so, if only the spelling in the audio examples would be correct. The guy who does most speaking there sounds in Russian just like a hillbilly would sound in American English, and I have constant feeling that he keeps chewing dry black garlic bread while speaking.

[mortimer-ford.livejournal.com]

There are three distinct speakers in the Pimsleur Russian series. One man who strikes me as competent, a gorgeous young woman who has sex in her ice-skates, and a round Hitchcock looking fellow who's tongue is not attached to his body.

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

I didn't have enough nerve to give a thorough listen to the whole thing, so I've only heard two voices, male and female. Both sound as if their bearers were hired at a contest organized among the workers at a food-and-clothes market in a small township not very far from the future site of 2014 Winter Olympics.

P.S.

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

Yet again, what you say is exactly my point - it trains you to keep the grocery-store level conversation, in the very best case.

another 2 cents from an ESL teacher

[scifigal.livejournal.com]

we studied various teaching methods in grad school, and from what everyone is saying, the Pimsleur method is simply the audiolingual method. Not weird, but rather a method popularized around 70 years ago.

Most teaching theories evolve as a direct reaction to a teaching method that was popular at the time and people felt didn't work. The audiolingual method was a reaction to the Reading Approach, which had little to no speaking or listening involved. The AL approach became popular between the 1940s and 1960s, so it's been around quite a while.

The belief behind AL is that language learning is about habit formation, and grammar is taught inductively rather than explicitly. Because of this, the belief is that you *don't* need to carefully explain which sounds they consist of, or how they are written.

I think this is becoming more popular with the rising popularity of podcasts.

It is a useful method for some people--especially people who are learning casually. If I want to learn to say a few things in Arabic, I don't need to learn how to write it, read it, or even understand why I'm saying it, but I'll be able to say "hello."

It can be a good supplement to other language learning, but for mastery of a language I believe it is incomplete.

Re: another 2 cents from an ESL teacher

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

Exactly my point: it might be an useful tool to make onbe able to lead a grocery-store-level concersation (or rather to be able to say something in a grocery store so that they sell you more or less exactly what you want, not "my hovercraft is full of eels (http://www.thisisawar.com/LaughterMPHungarian.htm)".) But this is not what people usually call learning a foreign language.

When in Portugal, I can say "desculpe, perdi o caminho" and "aqui esta o meu pasaporte", but this does not mean that I can speak Portuguese.
Anyway, I know how those little phrases are written, and do not memorize them as silly conglomerates of approximate sounds, but then, different people have different leading type of memory -- audial, visual, etc.

[jawlenska.livejournal.com]

I started with Pimsleur, too and I got really upset about the whole thing. What I hated most was the fact that they didn't explain things like declination of adjectives. Things which require further explanation since they aren't easy to comprehend at once. I think this language course was designed for business people who aren't actually interested in learning the language properly but who have to learn some phrases by heart just in order to be able to communicate. =D

So I just used this course to see how long my interest in the Russian language lasted. And after some months I decided to learn it at a professional language school - which I would recommend, too.

(sorry for the bad English, I'm not a native speaker...)

[scifigal.livejournal.com]

A desire to communicate is a great goal. Being able to simply say "hello" to someone you know is a great goal. It's also a very different teaching method than is typical in schools, but if you think about it, it's how you would teach a kid--say and repeat.

It would be a terrible system for me--I'm not much of an audio learner. Much more visual and tactile. But for people who learn best by listening--awesome.

[tuopierpaolo.livejournal.com]

Hallo! About the russian world, I wrote a post about! They are difficolut, but wonderful.. and have a magic power! Never give up :-)

Bye from Italy

[mortimer-ford.livejournal.com]

Pimsleur often uses the phrase 'yih-shoo-ras' to say, 'yet again', or 'one more time'. Sorry, but I cannot type that out in Cyrillic. This is different than the examples I have given above. What is more correct, I am not sure. I only speak Pimsleur.

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

>What is more correct, I am not sure. I only speak Pimsleur.

There you are. It's ещё раз.