(no subject)

[wolfie-18.livejournal.com]

It's that time of the month/random moment of time where I've read a fairy tale and have questions about the ever-boggling language that is Russian. This time, my reading has gone from a series of little really children books called Планета Детства to Путешествие в сказку (They mention a website, see if it's any good www.strekoza.ru ) and this time, these stories are about 20 pages long with just a picture here and there. It's death for me, needless to say. Anywho, here are my preguntas.

Well, the usual vocabulary I need help with: освещен, чадо, управлять, прочел (what’s the difference between this and прочитал), приведены, златогривый, боярин (dictionary says boyar… but I still don’t know what that is…), запечалиться, почтет, браный, заколол, пододаль, стращать the differences between искать, отыскать, cыскать

And I need help with some translations:

Кто изловит её живую, тому ещё при жизни моей отдам половину царства, а по смерти и всё. – Whoever catches her alive, I’ll give that person half my kingdom throughout my life, and upon my death, the whole of it (?)

Это перо сияло будто великое множество свеч. – This feather shined as if there were a great number of candles (?)

I also don’t understand these ежели constructions. They all seem like fragments. «Ну, ежели и ты от меня уедешь, и вы все трое долго не возвратитесь? Я уже стар и ежели что случится, то кто вместо меня будет управлять моим царством?»

Однако сколько царь Выслав ни старался удерживать Ивана-царевича, но никак не мог не отпустить его. – The сколько and the many negations confuse me…

 

What would be the English equivalent (if there is any) of ли in the following? Едет близко ли, далеко ли, низко ли, высоко ли, (and the rest I need a translation) скоро сказка сказывается, да нескоро дело делается...

 

Пошёл пеший – I had always thought the set expression was пойти пешком

 

...и устал несказанно – and became unspeakably tired?

 

… и серый волк помчался с ним пуще коня... – and the grey wolf rushed with him (Ivan) emptier horse???

 

… тут за стеною сад... – shouldn’t сад be in the genitive? (behind the wall of the garden)

 

«Что я взял жар-птицу без клетки, куда я её посажу?» - How is the что used here?

 

...съездишь за тридевять земель, в тридесятое государство – A total of three different tsars ask for this favor, and each time it’s to go to a different tsar. Is this an expression? I’m also confused about this тридевять...

 

… и откуда родом – and from what lineage?

 

…и побежал с нею что есть силы-мочи – With all his strength?

 

Cерый волк вымолвил эти речи, ударился о сыру землю... I really don’t understand both usage of o, and I’m guessing cыру is a typo, but what, the cheesy earth?

 

Дмитрий вынул из ножон меч свой... – should it be ножен?

 

(Это) Иван-царевич, которого вы злой смерти предали – I don’t understand the structure… It’s Ivan-tsaryevich, whom you evilly gave death to? (why is смерть in the genitive?)

 

What’s the difference between увидала and увидела?

 

Aaaand for my final question: Are these characters somewhat “recycled?” I remember seeing several quite different versions of Снегурочка, and here Иван-царевич goes on yet another crazy adventure. Country icon?

Comments

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

Humphhhh... that's a lot :)

I'll start with what I see right now:

Боярин - masculine singular; боярыня - fem.singular; бояре - plural. This is correct. The word means the anciend aristocracy in Russia, the members of ancient noble families -- as opposed to дворянин/дворянка/дворяне, the "new nobles," who were "simply noble" - not born to an ancient family, but granted the noblesse by the Tsar.

освещен - literally "lit," past tense participle (short form) from "освещать", to light up.
чадо - Church Slavonic for "a child"
управлять - to rule, to govern
прочел (what’s the difference between this and прочитал) - exactly the same as прочитал, the difference is negligible.
приведены - another participle past tense, this time in plural, means "brought"
златогривый - old poetic (from Church Slavonic) for "golden-maned," about a horse
запечалиться - to be engraved, to stay in the memory
почтёт - old verb *future tense, 3rd singular) for "will reckon," "will consider"
браный --- hmmm??? maybe бранный? then it's both "curse" (like in "curse words") and "battle" (like in "battle gear".)
заколол - has killed by the point of a sword or a spear
пододаль -- never heard this one, but it might mean something like "not very far"
стращать -- old and|or colloquial for "to frighten"
the differences between искать, отыскать, cыскать: the 1st one is imperf.(to seek, to look for) while two others are perf. (the last one being quite old.) i.e. to find, to discover.

Пошёл пеший – I had always thought the set expression was пойти пешком
You were right, but this is just an old expression with the same meaning.

ежели is the old form of если, i.e. "if".

ударился о сыру землю is a set expression from old fairy tales, literally means "threw himself on the wet ground," this сыру being a brief form of сырую: сырой, сырая, сырое - sligtly wet (not so wet as мокрый, but still not dry :))))

вынул из ножон меч свой... – should it be ножен? -- you're right, this might be a stylization in order to make the phraze sound more "ancient" :))

Are these characters somewhat “recycled?” -- yes they are.

Many your guesses are right :)

For the sake of the seventh letter

[mithgol.livejournal.com]

For foreigners learning the pronunciation of unknown words, using the seventh letter of Russian alphabet is important.

освещён

прочёл
 

[wolfie-18.livejournal.com]

Thanks, this book unfortunately does not have accents, but I do to an extent "feel" that прочёл had an ё. I would have missed it in освещён, though.

I would have thought there was an accent in приведёны? Or no, is that wrong?

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

No, it's приведенЫ. Приведён (singular,) though.

[wolfie-18.livejournal.com]

Приведены also seemed like it would mean "brought," but upon the context of the sentence... it seems like it means invisible or something...

... и только что снял - как вдруг пошёл гром и шум по всем конюшням, потому что к той узде были струны приведены.

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

Ah, OK, it's kind of brought - it means that the strings were attached to that bridle, brought from all stables and attached to one bridle.

[wolfie-18.livejournal.com]

Oh, and what's the infinitive of почтёт?

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

Почесть perf., почитать imp. - I guess so.

[yms.livejournal.com]

запечалиться - to be engraved, to stay in the memory

it's not запечатлиться, it's запечалиться! "Starting to get sad."

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

Sheesh. Well, if there's typos in the world, there definitely must be "reados" :))))

[temcat.livejournal.com]

OK, not all at once, but some quickies:

1) Кто изловит её живую, тому ещё при жизни моей отдам половину царства, а по смерти и всё. – Whoever catches her alive, I’ll give that person half my kingdom throughout my life, and upon my death, the whole of it.

Yes, that basically right.

2) Это перо сияло будто великое множество свеч. – This feather shined as if there were a great number of candles

Yes, but I would say "if there were" is redundant.

3)Ну, ежели и ты от меня уедешь, и вы все трое долго не возвратитесь? Я уже стар и ежели что случится, то кто вместо меня будет управлять моим царством?

But what if you leave me, too, and all three of you won't return for a long time? I'm old already, and who will govern my kingdom if something happens with me?

4) Однако сколько царь Выслав ни старался удерживать Ивана-царевича, но никак не мог не отпустить его.

However much tried king Vyslav to hold Tsarevich Ivan go, he could not but let him go.

The translation is awkward, but you got the point.

5) Пошёл пеший – I had always thought the set expression was пойти пешком

The first variant is very folkish.

6) ...и устал несказанно – and became unspeakably tired?

Yeah, literally so, but you don't say that in English, do you?

7)… и серый волк помчался с ним пуще коня... – and the grey wolf rushed with him (Ivan) emptier horse???

Пуще = больше, here it means быстрее

8) … тут за стеною сад... – shouldn’t сад be in the genitive? (behind the wall of the garden)

= тут за стеною есть сад

9)«Что я взял жар-птицу без клетки, куда я её посажу?» - How is the что used here?

Что can mean зачем or почему

10)...съездишь за тридевять земель, в тридесятое государство – A total of three different tsars ask for this favor, and each time it’s to go to a different tsar. Is this an expression? I’m also confused about this тридевять...

Yeah, this is just an expression that means "far, far away". DOn;t think too much about it ;-) Тридевять means 27 (3 x 9), AFAIU.

11)… и откуда родом – and from what lineage?

yes

12) …и побежал с нею что есть силы-мочи – With all his strength?

yes

13) Cерый волк вымолвил эти речи, ударился о сыру землю... I really don’t understand both usage of o, and I’m guessing cыру is a typo, but what, the cheesy earth?

сыру = сырую

14) Дмитрий вынул из ножон меч свой... – should it be ножен?

Yes, but I guess this variant exists, too

15) (Это) Иван-царевич, которого вы злой смерти предали – I don’t understand the structure… It’s Ivan-tsaryevich, whom you evilly gave death to? (why is смерть in the genitive?)

It’s Ivan-tsaryevich, whom you put to a terrible death.

Смерть is in dative here. Предать means "to subject to" here.

16) What’s the difference between увидала and увидела?

no difference, oter than the forst is colloquial.

17) Aaaand for my final question: Are these characters somewhat “recycled?” I remember seeing several quite different versions of Снегурочка, and here Иван-царевич goes on yet another crazy adventure. Country icon?

Yes, they are.

[temcat.livejournal.com]

However much tried king Vyslav to hold Tsarevich Ivan, he could not but let him go.

There was a redundant "go" :-)

[wolfie-18.livejournal.com]

-Yeah, literally so, but you don't say that in English, do you?

Yeah, we do say it, but it sounds awkward in that sentence.

[buddah-gautama.livejournal.com]

Well, the usual vocabulary I need help with:

освещен - illuminated,
чадо - child (almost not used by now),
управлять - rule,
прочел (what’s the difference between this and прочитал) - read... there is almost no difference between "прочел" & "прочитал". The second is more official maybe,
приведены - depends on context... possibly "were lead to" someone or something,
златогривый - something with the golden mane,
боярин (dictionary says boyar… but I still don’t know what that is…) - boyar is the deputy of State Duma, noble person,
запечалиться - get sad (not used by now),
почтет - possibly the right is "почет" - honour,
браный - possibly the right is "бранный" - martial (not used by now) but it depends on context... so it could be "abusive" or something,
заколол - stabed,
пододаль possibly the right is "поодаль" - means "not too far away of" (not used by now),
стращать the differences between искать - "стращать" means scare (not used by now), "искать" means search... That's the difference...
отыскать - find,
cыскать - find (not used by now)

And I need help with some translations:

Кто изловит её живую, тому ещё при жизни моей отдам половину царства, а по смерти и всё. – Whoever catches her alive, I’ll give that person half my kingdom throughout my life, and upon my death, the whole of it (?) - true

Это перо сияло будто великое множество свеч. – This feather shined as if there were a great number of candles (?) true

I also don’t understand these ежели constructions. They all seem like fragments. «Ну, ежели и ты от меня уедешь, и вы все трое долго не возвратитесь? Я уже стар и ежели что случится, то кто вместо меня будет управлять моим царством?»

ежели (not used by now) means "if"...

Однако сколько царь Выслав ни старался удерживать Ивана-царевича, но никак не мог не отпустить его. – The сколько and the many negations confuse me...

In this context "сколько" means "how hard didn't Vyslav tryed"... Something like that...

What would be the English equivalent (if there is any) of ли in the following? Едет близко ли, далеко ли, низко ли, высоко ли, (and the rest I need a translation) скоро сказка сказывается, да нескоро дело делается...

I'm no sure about any equivalent, sorry...

Пошёл пеший – I had always thought the set expression was пойти пешком - true... "пеший" - is almost not used by now...

...и устал несказанно – and became unspeakably tired? - true

… и серый волк помчался с ним пуще коня... – and the grey wolf rushed with him (Ivan) emptier horse??? - faster than horse

… тут за стеною сад... – shouldn’t сад be in the genitive? (behind the wall of the garden) - it means "the garden behind the wall"

«Что я взял жар-птицу без клетки, куда я её посажу?» - How is the что used here? - didn't get it... really...:)

...съездишь за тридевять земель, в тридесятое государство – A total of three different tsars ask for this favor, and each time it’s to go to a different tsar. Is this an expression? I’m also confused about this тридевять... - this is just an expression that means "very very far"

… и откуда родом – and from what lineage? - means "where from"

…и побежал с нею что есть силы-мочи – With all his strength? - true

Cерый волк вымолвил эти речи, ударился о сыру землю... I really don’t understand both usage of o, and I’m guessing cыру is a typo, but what, the cheesy earth? - "o сыру землю" - is an expression that in fairytales usualy precedes any magic transformation... hmmm... Something like "strike agains the ground"

Дмитрий вынул из ножон меч свой... – should it be ножен? - yep

(Это) Иван-царевич, которого вы злой смерти предали – I don’t understand the structure… It’s Ivan-tsaryevich, whom you evilly gave death to? (why is смерть in the genitive?) - It's the expression that is not used by now...

What’s the difference between увидала and увидела? - "увидала" - is the common language

Aaaand for my final question: Are these characters somewhat “recycled?” I remember seeing several quite different versions of Снегурочка, and here Иван-царевич goes on yet another crazy adventure. Country icon? - yep... Something like...

Good luck...

Поправка.

[ex-ex-zhuzh.livejournal.com]

Браный means "embroidered", often in "скатерти браные". It's an obsolete word (and different from бранный).

[wolfie-18.livejournal.com]

Oops, there was a скатерти there (just didn't know whether or not it affected браный). Thanks though, I was beginning to get confused.

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

Ah, OK, another set expression from fairy tales. Provide more context next time, please :)

[wolfie-18.livejournal.com]

You don't ALWAYS have to get it right :p Besides, would you prefer more context or less space taken up? I sometimes feel I ask too much.

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

What I feel is that one doesn't have to be afraid to post more often - but in smaller chunks :) It's always more easy to answer a few questions a few times a day, than a Heck of a lot of questions once a week :)

[noser.livejournal.com]

> «Что я взял жар-птицу без клетки, куда я её посажу?» - How is the что used here?

Что = почему here, like temcat says. One important note, however: in such a case "что" must be strongly stressed upon.

Good job with the "Russian" quotes, btw. :)

> What would be the English equivalent (if there is any) of ли in the following? Едет близко ли, далеко ли, низко ли, высоко ли

"Whether [he/she/it] travels near, whether far, whether low, whether high..." Does it make sense?

> (and the rest I need a translation) скоро сказка сказывается, да нескоро дело делается...

"It takes little time to tell a tale, but not little to get things done"? Sounds really awkward to me, but you get the idea :)

[wolfie-18.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I suppose it makes sense. Just have to fine-tune my Russian state of mind :)

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

за тридевять земель, в тридесятое государство is a set fairy tale expression, which simply means "very far away" :)

[yk4ever.livejournal.com]

почтёт - future tense verb:
1) will consider (rarely used, more often written as "сочтёт")
2) will honor (ex: "почтил присутствием" - "honored us by his presence")

и побежал с нею что есть силы-мочи – With all his strength?

"мочи" is a genitive of never-used-in-nominative noun, formed from almost-never-used-in-infinitive verb "мочь-могу-можешь-может-могут", equivalent of "can". So, "крикнул что есть мочи" literally means "shouted with all his ability".

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

"David danced before the Lord with all his might." I thik that the might is the right word here :)

[mithgol.livejournal.com]

Here „мочь“ is a form of „мощь“ (“might”).

[ekeme-ndiba.livejournal.com]

In fact, the native Russian noun «мочь» was replaced by the Church Slavonic form «мощь» in modern Russian.