Pronouncing «е»

[ugly-boy.livejournal.com]

How do you know when 'е' is pronounced йэ and when it's simply pronounced э? Romanization schemes don't always help—some always write it as je/ye and others always write it as e preferring to write э as è. For instance, I know that at the beginning of a word 'е' is always pronounced йэ but I'm not sure about the middle and end of a word. I know that нет = нйэт but what about не? I always assumed that привет was pronounced 'привэт' until a Russian woman at work greeted me with a cheery Privjet! the other day. What's the deal?

Also, can я, ё, and ю ever be pronounced а, о, and у? And why isn't there a йи sound like there is in Ukranian (Її)?

Comments

[karakal.livejournal.com]

'e' is always pronounced 'йэ' except a few words originating from foreign languages (French or English mostly), with tendency to pronounce 'йэ' even in these few.

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[ugly-boy.livejournal.com]

I've noticed that the letter "e" is almost always transliterated into Russian as е. For instance, in writing my name in Russian I prefer to write Сэдрик because it is more likely to be pronounced correctly, but I'm continuously told that it's wrong!

[karakal.livejournal.com]

Oh yes, personal names are among those few words with 'э' pronunciation. And if you want to have your name be pronounced correctly, you're absolutely right if you write it with 'э'.

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[ugly-boy.livejournal.com]

That's what I figure though I've been "corrected."

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[ugly-boy.livejournal.com]

That's what I think but I've been "corrected" by people.

[yers.livejournal.com]

Er, no. "E" is better.
You see, Э is the only "posh" letter of the Russian alphabet, in the way that Q and X are in English. So it's rather unstylish to use it where "е" would be enough. When a Russian speaker comes across what obviously looks like a foreign name, s/he would intuitively pronounce "е" as "э". An occasional palatisation might slip in, but it doesn't make a big difference. Hard and soft consonants aren't treated as two separate sounds in Russian, unlike, say, n/ñ in Spanish, but as two variations of the same sound. "Э" is rather used to emphasize the openness of the vowel sound (in formal pronounciation, "э" is a slightly differently coloured vowel than the vocal part of "е"), so it's more or less reserved for sounds of the a-umlaut type, like 'a' in 'cat'.

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[ugly-boy.livejournal.com]

I always use Э for [æ] the sound in cat. Thank you for the tip... It's just a little pet peeve of mine. In Belarusan it's acceptable to write my name with Э.

[yers.livejournal.com]

Not only acceptable but also, I believe, mandatory. But Belarusian has a totally different philosophy of spelling. It's very hard to read with just your eyes if you know Russian, but when you try reading the words aloud in your head they suddenly become recognizable...

[karakal.livejournal.com]

"Also, can я, ё, and ю ever be pronounced а, о, and у?"

Never.

[b0bb.livejournal.com]

I wonder what gave you the idea that you can get away with disinforming these poor foreigners?

"Also, can я, ё, and ю ever be pronounced а, о, and у?"

Commonly - after consonants, which are palatalized in those cases.

[karakal.livejournal.com]

"why isn't there a йи sound like there is in Ukranian (Її)"

why isn't there a йи sound in other languages? in English, for instance?

To be serious. I can realize that spoken languages of eastern Slavic nations sound all alike to western nations. To Russian ear, however, Ukrainian or Belorussian are distinctly different both from each other and Russian.

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[ugly-boy.livejournal.com]

I was just wondering because there is a "j" diphthong with every vowel but ы and и.

ji

[caralho.livejournal.com]

There was such a sound with a special letter for it, ѣ ("ять"). Later, pronunciation of this letter became identical to "е" in most dialects, producing useless difficulties for students who had to learn additional spelling rules. Finally, this letter was abolished in 1918.

Re: ji

[ugly-boy.livejournal.com]

That character appears in the Lucida Sans Unicode font: for anyone (like myself) who couldn't see it in the original post.

Thank you for this information!

[oblomov-jerusal.livejournal.com]

е is always pronounced as э after consonants which cannot be palatalized — ж, ц, ш.

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[ugly-boy.livejournal.com]

Thank you.

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[ugly-boy.livejournal.com]

Thank you.

[b0bb.livejournal.com]

After all the consonants!
Ability to be palatalized is completely different matter.

[oblomov-jerusal.livejournal.com]

To your second question, there are 3 words containing combination шю or жю: брошюра, жюри, парашют (brochure, jury, parachute). In these words ю is pronounced as у. (They are all from French, and ю represents French u). Out of my head, I can think 3 words with шё or жё: шёл (went), шёлк (silk), жёлтый (yellow). In those, ё is pronounced as о. Probably there are another examples. I don't think there are any words with я pronounced as а.

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[ugly-boy.livejournal.com]

Wow, thank you very much!

[karakal.livejournal.com]

Well, yes, I was wrong. Sorry. In cases where ё is preceded by a hissing consonant, it's always pronounced 'o'.

[irkin.livejournal.com]

Once I tried to explain the pronunciation of the Russian vowels to my Spanish friend. I'll write that explication to you. (I have a feeling that I posted it here some time ago..=)

All the Russian vowels can be divided in two groups:
а, о, у, ы, э are hard and represent one sound.
е, ё, ю, я are soft and represent combination of a consonant (or semivowel?) й and other vowel, i.e.: е - йэ, ё - йо, ю - йу, я - йа.

There's also и that is soft but it can't be represented as "йы":)

It's hard to formulate rules for what you've been using all your life without thinking but I think the rule is: After soft or hard sign or in the beginning of the syllable/word soft vowels are pronounced as in alphabet (like йэ, йо, йу, йа) and the consonant sounds soft or hard depending on the sign. But inside the syllable the soft vowels soften the preceding consonant and are pronounced as respective hard vowels (е as э, ё as о, ю as у, я as а). In other words the hard consonants "steals" the soft part from the soft vowel and makes itself soft and the vowel hard :)

Examples:
не = нь (soft) + э
нье = нь (soft) + е (йэ)
нэ = н (hard) + э

лю (as in "люблю" (I love)) = ль + у
лью (I pour) = ль + йу

The difference is where you pronounce й and where you do not (й sounds as "y" in "boy").

It's the common mistake of foreigners - they add й where it isn't supposed to be. They say привьет instead of привет. It's difficult to understand how to pronounce soft consonants :) I think the only way to do it is to listen to the native speakes and repeat after them.

нет is also not нйэт. It's rather ньэт. There's also no й.

--
I think the words when е is pronounced as э are exceptions. And sometimes people pronounce them differently. For example in the word "проект" should be pronounced as проэкт. But there's one jornalist on Russian EuroNews channel who pronounces it like проект (пройэкт). It "cuts my ears" :) And on the contrary she pronounces "сервер" as "сэрвер" though it should be сервер and that irritates me too :)


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Sorry for such a long comment :)

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[ugly-boy.livejournal.com]

Interesting, and very helpful! Thank you! I'm adding this entry to my memories because of all the helpful comments.

[b0bb.livejournal.com]

First quite correct comment in that chorus of ignorant Russian-native speakers!