Food

[cle-fable.livejournal.com]

Hi all,

I was wondering if you could describe the following foodstuffs as I'm not sure exactly what they are:

Kefir - some kind of milk but is there something characteristic about it?

pelmeni - like ravioli but without sauce? - is it pasta or something different?

tvorogi - I've never known the meaning of this.

siroki or is it sirozhki - like a sweet cheese in chocolate?

vinigrette - are there any vegetables it has to contain in order to be vinigrette?

pryaniki - are these just finger snacks?

Thank you.

Comments

[oryx_and_crake]

Kefir - buttermilk (fermented dairy product, like drinking yoghurt)

pelmeni - like ravioli but with meat filling. They are usually bigger than the ravioli I've seen. If the filling is other than meat (e.g. potato or cherries) they are called vareniki.

tvorogi - it's tvorog, not "tvorogi"; as this is the name of a substance, it cannot take plural, in the same way as you cannot say "milks". It's like unsalted pressed cottage cheese

siroki or is it sirozhki - I think you meant "syrki" which is plural of syrok which is indeed a cheesecake and may be chocolate-covered or contain raisins or something.

vinigrette - vinegret (mind the spelling) must contain beets, potatoes, pickled cucumber, optionally diced onion and/or sour cabbage, with mayonnaise or vegetable oil

pryaniki - are these just finger snacks? - not at all. They are a specific kind of spiced cookies.

[khathi.livejournal.com]

No, there is NO mayonnaise in vinegret. Much as I like mayo, the tendency of many Russian home cooks to stick it wherever possible is somewhat, ahem, unsettling.

[oryx_and_crake]

What do you mean no mayonnaise? If people make it with mayonnaise, it will contain mayonnaise.

[kroshkaboo.livejournal.com]

but the usual recipe doesn't include mayo in vinegret! look at any cookbook.

[oryx_and_crake]

I don't know what "the usual recipe" is. If I put mayonnaise instead of oil in my vinegret, does it stop being a vinegret and start being something altogether different?

[khathi.livejournal.com]

Yep, it becomes olivier with beets. These two salads are very close to each other, main difference being that vinegret usually doesn't contain any meat, that olivier has no beets, and the dressing.

[oryx_and_crake]

There is no such thing as "olivier with beets". Besides, I don't agree that the two salads are very close to each other. It is like saying that the giraffe is very close to a tiger, the main difference being that the giraffe does not eat meat and the tiger has short neck.

[kart.livejournal.com]

I made салат оливье with beets once and it stained everything pink. Not good.

[kroshkaboo.livejournal.com]

if you put beef in the soup instead of a chicken, does it stop being a chicken soup?

[oryx_and_crake]

Dressing is not what makes a vinegret a vinegret. Otherwise all the possible salads with vegetable oil would be just different kinds of vinegret, which is not the case.

[zauberer.livejournal.com]

Vinegret originally comes from French "vinaigre" which means, well, vinegar. So this is a salad that is dressed with vinegar and oil, not mayonnaise. Modern vinegret must also contain beets, and these things together (beets+oil+vinegar) make the salad a vinegret.

[kart.livejournal.com]

Mayonnaise contains oil and vinegar (or lemon juice), just like a vinaigrette. Only difference is that the ingredients in mayo are emulsified with egg yolks. In traditional vinaigrette is not emulsified.

Anyhow, IMHO винегрет should not be creamy, so I would not use mayo either.

[oryx_and_crake]

No one I know adds vinegar to vinegret.

[joliecanard.livejournal.com]

I have never seen vinegret dressed with mayo either.

For future references :)

[pinky-the-cow.livejournal.com]

Винегрет из овощей

Вареный картофель, яблоки, огурцы, морковь очистить, нарезать ломтиками, кубиками или соломкой, сложить в миску, прибавить квашеную шинкованную капусту. Горчицу, соль, перец, сахар растереть с маслом и развести уксусом. Перед тем как подать к столу, овощи смешать с приготовленным соусом, уложить в салатник, украсить ломтиками свеклы, посыпать зеленым луком и кукропом. Можно украсить винегрет также свежими огурцами и помидорами. Винегрет получается более вкусным, если его заправить соусом майонез.
Винегрет с солеными грибами приготовляют точно так же, причем берут разные грибы — примерно 25 г на порцию.
На 4—5 шт. вареного картофеля — 1 свеклу, 1 морковь, 2 соленых огурца, 1 свежее или моченое яблоко, 100 г квашеной капусты, 50 г зеленого лука, 2—3 ст. ложки растительного масла, 1/4 стакана уксуса, 1 чайную ложку горчицы, сахар по вкусу.

Cited from good old (although Soviet) "Book on tasty and healthy food", published by Pischepromizdat.
Hence, viva la mayonnaise.

Re: For future references :)

[pinky-the-cow.livejournal.com]

Yay, I really have managed to miss a typo.

*sigh*

[khathi.livejournal.com]

People may bathe in mayonnaise, but it doesn't mean that it's a right thing to do with it.

[oryx_and_crake]

I am not discussing what's right and what's wrong here. There are some haut cuisine schools that will murder you if you as much as say that olivier is a food fit for human consumption. But we, here, discuss what people really eat (as in, what you can see in the kitchen when you drop by your friend's house).

[khathi.livejournal.com]

Whatever. Vinegret isn't dressed with mayo, that's all.

[korollapushki.livejournal.com]

+1000

[colonelrabin.livejournal.com]

Holy war! Holy war!

[miconazole.livejournal.com]

If so, then it's the strangest holy war I have ever seen.

But maybe I am not passionate enough about salad.

[oryx_and_crake]

Oh, mayonnaise is a holy war topic.
Try to mention it in kitchen_nax and see what happens.
See also here: Mayonnaisus Infinitas

Disclaimer: personally I hate the tendency of smothering everything with mayonnaise, especially with subsequent thermal processing, but, unfortunately, it prevails in popular cuisine of the former USSR.

[khathi.livejournal.com]

I'm not Stalic! ;)

[la-dy-ashley.livejournal.com]

Depends. I never knew it can have oil dressig till I saw it in my high school canteen. Had always been mayonnaise before. My family and most people we mixed with used mayo.

[khathi.livejournal.com]

Anyway, "vinegret" comes from the French "vinaigrette", which is a salad dressing made of, well, vinegar and oil, so it's the original and most correct one.

[katrushkita.livejournal.com]

Kefir - yes it is dairy. It is a bit like sour milk and a bit bubbly and thick.

Pel'meni - a bit like ravioli, or meat filled dumplings.

tvorog - similar to cottage cheese but drier and often sweetened or paired with fruit (raisins or apricots)

sirok - think chocolate dipped cheesecake in a small serving

vinagret - salad - i don't think there are requisite veggies, but i might be wrong

Pryaniki - little cookies that are a bit soft and "puffy", sometimes filled with preserves (like cranberries) and dusted in powdered sugar. the almond ones are my favourite.

[acuzena.livejournal.com]

"tvorog ... often sweetened or paired with fruit (raisins or apricots)" not really, tvorog is often used as a primary product for other unsweetened dishes. When it is sweetened or with fruits added it is tvorozhnaya massa.
I might be wrong, but almond pryaniki are not typically Russian. Excuse my ignorance, but I´m Russian and have never tasted it, probably I was just unhappy to not to come across with them at home.

[oryx_and_crake]

I agree with acuzena. Pryaniki aren't puffy either; they are made of very dense dough. Filling is not necessary either. Here's an example:

[racoonbear.livejournal.com]

Good example, btw!

[khathi.livejournal.com]

5. - There should be at least diced beets, potatoes and pickled cucumber in vinegret. Onion and cooked green peas are also a must.

6. - No. Pryaniki are basically just gingerbreads.

[lenny-goofoff.livejournal.com]

gingerbread! ditto
sometimes filled with jam
http://x-food.ru/uploads/1207926567_prjaniki.jpg
http://menggarang.blogspot.com/2006/03/tulsky-pryanik.html

and I believe, beets are essential in vinegret (never tried to dress it with mayo 8-0)

[khathi.livejournal.com]

Exactly.

[acuzena.livejournal.com]

Kefir is a milk product that contains beneficial yeasts, looks like drinking yogurt, but is usually unsweetened. http://www.kuking.net/pictures/section/18/18_531.jpg

Pelmeni to me are bigger in size than ravioli, comparing with them have a more round shape and should be filled with chopped meat with a bit of onion. Unlike ravioli that may contain cottage cheese, spinach, etc. Served with butter, mayo or sour cream. http://www.millionmenu.spb.ru/IMG/im30_25480.jpg

Tvorog (not tvorogi) is more difficult to explain, smth similar to cottage cheese but is usually more sour and have a different consistence. http://www.skitalets.ru/shop/images/tvorog_gotov.jpg

Syrok (syrki pl.) - sweetened tvorog covered with chocolate, often contains filling of cocoa, raisin, etc. http://irc.lv/images/qna/538351_424667.jpeg

In my opinion vinigret should absolutely contain boiled beet, beans, pickles, boiled potatoes and be dressed with vegetable oil. All the rest - up to the cooker´s taste. http://www.aif.ru/application/public/news/991/250fca7016398abd903136b6cd78f40e_medium.jpg

Pryanik is a gingerbread I think. http://img0.liveinternet.ru/images/attach/b/3/19/853/19853556_1171705636.jpg

[sofa-m.livejournal.com]

Kefir - read all about it http://www.lifeway.net
Pelmeni - a lot like Chinese dumplings with meat
tvorog - farmer's cheese

[kart.livejournal.com]

China and Russia both received meat dumpling recipes from the same source: Siberia. :))

[gazapa.livejournal.com]

I like my vinigret with sour cream.

Now the group has defined "pryaniki"

[pastilla.livejournal.com]

Zakuski = finger snacks, "little bites"

You probably knew that, though :)

Re: Now the group has defined "pryaniki"

[oryx_and_crake]

Not at all. Закуски just means "starters", anything that is served before the main entree (not including soups though). They may or may not be finger foods. Most Russian закуски are salads, which definitely are not finger foods.

Re: Now the group has defined "pryaniki"

[pastilla.livejournal.com]

:: facepalm ::

[santa-chica.livejournal.com]

foreigners call vinegret 'russian salad'

[kart.livejournal.com]

That's because they use the word vinaigrette to mean only the sauce, whereas винегрет is the whole salad. :)

[drrragon-fly.livejournal.com]

they call olivie Russian Salad)

The Kefir Paradox ;)

[alek-morse.livejournal.com]

if you are interested in cultural/symbolic meaning of kefir in Russian cinema, I highly recommend you see the kid's sci-fi mini "Guest From the Future"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guests_from_the_Future

and read my essay "The Kefir Paradox"
http://alek-morse.livejournal.com/20904.html#cutid2

:)

[drrragon-fly.livejournal.com]

tvorog is a curd - correct me if i'm wrong.

[xlns-7.livejournal.com]

good stuff for learners of Russian on Russian Word of the Day

салат (винегрет included)
http://shininghappypeople.net/rwotd/blog4.php/2009/05/27/-151

пельмени
http://shininghappypeople.net/rwotd/blog4.php/2009/12/17/-340

[dumak.livejournal.com]

http://rt.com/Russia_Now/Russian_cuisine.html - enjoy Russian cuisine! :)