Hi--kind of off-topic question about МГУ (MSU)

[anima-maxima.livejournal.com]

Hello everyone,

I have a question about international graduate students at Moscow State University--namely, how hard is it to be accepted to the University? I've been looking on the website and it's pretty sparse. I'm hoping to study political science, wherever I end up, in the fall of 2009. I'm aiming for a doctorate.

If anyone has personal experience in graduate studies at МГУ or any other Russian institution, could you please share?

Comments

[madrumos.livejournal.com]

I can't really answer your questions, but...

Keep in mind that Russia has a very different educational system than the US or Europe. There is no doctorate per se, there are two different levels of post-undergraduate work that don't quite match up with other countries' levels. Wikipedia can help you further.

I am 99% sure that MGU does not offer a Western-style doctorate.

Also, while I'm sure you get something of a decent education, it can't compare to even mid-level US universities, and certainly not in political science. I'm applying to polisci programs in the US this year. If you ever want to get a decent job in academia or research (or any job in the US at all based on your PhD), a Russian degree will get you nowhere -- you'll have to get a real PhD later anyway. The level of rigorousness, approach to the discipline, style of research, and just quality of education is vastly different and generally severely lacking here compared to in the West.

Plus, you probably couldn't get much of a stipend here, whereas PhDs are paid for everywhere else. And Moscow is a fantastically expensive city to live in, and MGU ain't cheap anymore either.

Hope this helps some! I love Russia and am living in Moscow near MGU currently, but education, like many things here, leaves much to be desired.

[ex-roumor.livejournal.com]

lies

[ex-roumor.livejournal.com]

and i dont love russia and moscow.

level of education is pretty good.

my sister graduated mgu this year.
80% of your time you will have to study, study, study... >..

[madrumos.livejournal.com]

Sorry, I didn't mean to seem so negative. I know MGU is a good school, I'm sure it is a lot of hard, genuine work to graduate from there, and I'm sure the education is fine...just in a different way than what you would get from Harvard, Berkeley, Madison, etc. If your goal is to get a decent, broad graduate education, then I think MGU would serve fine. If you want to be in the running for a faculty position in the top 50 political science programs in the world or get published in a large journal, then MGU will not work, at least not by itself. I recently attended a conference in Moscow on the latest in political economy research, put on by the Russian Higher School of Economics and other Russian institutions, and no one from any Russian state school was represented there, despite there being a wide range of Russian scholars from various fields.

So I think it all depends what you want to get out of it.

At the very least, you should be confident in my assessment of how expensive Moscow is to live in!

Didn't mean to knock MGU in general or others' experiences there. Just callin' it like I sees it.

[anima-maxima.livejournal.com]

It's okay. You gave your opinion. I am glad that you did. :)

[creiz.livejournal.com]

Well, I'm afraid I can't be much of help with МГУ, but at least something.
First, you could browse МГУ's site: here's info for international students in English http://www.msu.ru/en/admissions/, then here's the page in Russian with general rules for post graduate education http://www.msu.ru/entrance/prp.html.

Unfortunatelly, Russia currently in a state of moving to a Western-style higher education system, so the 2 systems can be found as of now.

Traditional Russian system consists of one level to get a diploma (you get qualification of Specialist in you chosen specialty), it usually takes 5 years to complete. Then, after you graduate, you can take postgraduate studies (аспирантура), which consists of 2 steps - Candidate’s degree (кандидат наук) and Doctor's degree (доктор наук).

I don't really wanna argue with the rather negative opinion represented above, it won't do anything good anyway. Just keep in mind that Russian universities aim to give all-round education while Western-style unis give much more narrow specialization. Also in the west you can choose what courses you're gonna take, in Russia the program you are expected to complete is pretty much set depending on your chosen upon entrance speciality, though there are different optional classes you can take if you want.

[archaicos.livejournal.com]

I don't know if it differs between MGU departments, but their math and physics entry exams at the physics dept are pretty intense and require some vety serious preparation.
Post grad education (towards what's called "candidate of science" and beyond) may be not bad, but may be not good enough. In Russia there's unfortunately a huge disconnection between the education itself and its application, making of cutting-edge and competitive products or services out of the research. The funding (or investment) is often scarce and there's generally no agility compared to the leading institutions in Europe and the US. I turned down my post grad studies 7 years ago and haven't regretted it so far.

[paparazzzzi.livejournal.com]

I'm MSU student, but I'm Russian. I suppose there are some difference between our studies and onew for foreign students. Anyway, I could tell you what I know about it by email, if you wish. jean.luc.doe@gmail.com

[myrtilus.livejournal.com]

I'm also at MSU, though in a technical field. And take it from me, you have to study much more than in the US.

You could try asking for information about your major over at the MSU livejournal community http://community.livejournal.com/msu
*and yes, you can post in English.

[paparazzzzi.livejournal.com]

BTW: http://www.msu.ru/en/admissions/

[anima-maxima.livejournal.com]

Thank you so much! :)

[sverensis.livejournal.com]

In my impression, MGU departments differ drastically as far as quality of education is concerned. The university has a very strong reputation in math and natural sciences and fares well on international university rankings in these fields (http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/hybrid.asp?typeCode=146).

It's a bit different with arts and humanities. I graduated from the faculty of history and had also taken a lot of classes at the faculty of philology. My subfield was medieval Scandinavian history, and I had an opportunity to compare the sort of training I had received at MGU with that of a leading Nordic school, the University of Oslo, where I was doing my M.Phil. It turned out that what one may call basic research skills -- competence in languages, both ancient and modern, ability to read manuscripts, acquaitance with previous research in the field -- all these things were taught much better in Moscow than in Oslo, even though it concerned Norwegian past, not Russian. But there was also something MGU had not given me: writing classes, thesis seminars, grounding in social theory and a lot more. Our profs had taught us efficiently to assemble evidence, but not so much to interpret it and to present the results of analysis.

But political science is neither math nor history. All social sciences departments of MGU are staffed with sometime teachers of "scientific communism" and similar disciplines or their ex-students. Many undergrads are not satisfied with education quality, and last year they publicly protested against it at the faculty of sociology. In my personal opinion, to continue your graduate studies in political sciences at MGU may be just a waste of time.

Besides, there is a whole lot of problems such as no university-based financial support, few if any courses taught in English, high living costs. A few years ago, at least, MGU seemed not particularly well adapted for international students.

If you wish to do a Ph.D. about Russian politics, it might be a good idea first to spend a year or two in Russia working, for example, for an international NGO, but then get your degree elsewhere.

[anima-maxima.livejournal.com]

Okay. Thank you so much for the in-depth explanation!