Gerunds again

[krasnojarsk.livejournal.com]

Vsem privet!

I have yet another gerund question, now regarding the fact that the gerund has to relate back to a subject, and the subject's main action. If we were to have a sentence with two actions, seemingly equal in importance, with a gerund relating back to the sentence, who would the gerund relate to? For example, Он купался, пока она играла, махая руками. Is it even possible to form a sentence like this in Russian? And is it clear who was waving their arms? And what about Он купался и она играла, махая руками. Is it even more clear here, that the last acting character (она) should be the one waving their arms?

Thanks in advance,
Pelle

Comments

[ars-longa.livejournal.com]

You can say it this way: пока он купался, она играла, махая руками. Or В то время как он купался, махая руками, она играла. Put on like that, there is no confusion over who was doing what.

[mr-uef.livejournal.com]

Он купался, пока она играла, махая руками.
yes, this indeed allows for some ambiguity, however, in this case the gerund tends to gravitate to the second action. To make it absolutely clear, you could rephrase this as
Он купался, пока она, махая руками, играла.
This would be a) gramatically correct b) non-ambiguos but c) stylistically awkward. You could spread this as:
Он купался, пока она, махая руками, играла у бассейна.
This sounds ok to me.

[katzk.livejournal.com]

Gerund relates to whatever it's closer to. In your example it's girl. Using this sentence and meaning the boy waving his hands would be highly incorrect.

Играла, махая руками doesn't look too good for me, but it's not grammatically wrong. It's just weird. :)

[m-t-a.livejournal.com]

I'm agree with last comment: grammatically sentence is right, but looks strange. What is the game, that absolutelly described as она махала руками? Who was waving their arms is clear: она.

[http://users.livejournal.com/_delly_/]

The thing is that "waving hands" in this case is not a gerund, but participle I.

Besides, "размахивая" sounds much nicer.

[arenhaime.livejournal.com]

Probably, in a situation like this we would think that a gerund goes with the "closest" verb\action. In that case sometimes there is no such ambiguity, sometimes there is.
It depends on meaning; in a sentence like Он смотрел, пока она купалась, размахивая руками gerund clearly goes with second verb (yeah, I know, it's an awkward sentence; it's just an example).
As for your example, as previous posts say, we try to avoid such ambiguity.

[flameaside.livejournal.com]

"размахивая", not "махая"

[krasnojarsk.livejournal.com]

Thank you all for your insightful comments! The idea with the sentence was to create some ambiguity, I would like to see if there are any "cracks" in the gerund rules of subject, since we start having some problems in sentences using for example phrases with "откровенно/честно/собственно говоря", in which the говоря often doesn't relate clearly to a subject. I apologise if I sound confused, I am but a layman trying to see if there can be any ambiguity at all when using gerunds. As for the sentence, I just thought of a simple one that clearly would confuse a reader as to which action/person the gerund is related to, I know it's a bit strange. :D

[krasnojarsk.livejournal.com]

By the way, if anyone would like to help me construct another "ambiguous" meaning with gerunds, I would be very thankful. :) (If it's even possible.)

[m-t-a.livejournal.com]

For example? Какой шаблон?

[krasnojarsk.livejournal.com]

Hmm, one with two subjects if possible, and two different main verbs, and then a gerund. Maybe it's hard though, seeing as there seems to be a rule that the last action is what the gerund relates to (like mr_uef said)

[m-t-a.livejournal.com]

Sentences with such construction and ambiguous meaning are rear, as I suppose.
Саша играла в волейбол, когда Лера звала знакомых, махая руками.
Водитель грузовика собирался проскочить, когда ему наперерез вылетел опаздывающий Марвин, прижимая педаль газа.
It's better than your sentence, but stylistically looks awfully. And again, there is no ambiguous meaning: it's clear, that gerund related to last verb.

[krasnojarsk.livejournal.com]

Aah, thank you for that! I guess I'll give up the idea of trying to poke holes in facts...:) Thank you though! I've learnt a lot!