Trying to Learn Russian

[yukinoitazuchi.livejournal.com]

Hello. I am a Sophomore in college now, already thinking about grad school. One of the colleges in my state is, IU, Indiana University. To graduate from IU, you have to be trilingual (information here). I, not to brag, am fluent in English (native speaker) and pretty fluent in Japanese (eight years). Fluency is used in a general sense. To one person I may be fluent, to another I may be worse than mediocre.

I was thinking about Russian as a third language. The good thing is that my college offers some Russian. I will probably have to take some my senior year.

I have been trying to study the alphabet and feel frustrated that this is not coming easy. I did not have this much trouble with Japanese or at least I do not think I did.

Any pointers?

[EDIT: I am also thinking about Korean as another possibility or just go to Ohio State. With Ohio State, money is an option since I am an Indiana native.]

Thank you very much!

Crossposted to linguaphiles, learn_russian

Comments

[khathi.livejournal.com]

Can you elaborate what exact difficulties are you encountering in your study? It's somewhat difficult to give advice without knowing what sort of it you need. But if you're studying alphabet now -- didn't you do the very popular mistake among the beginners, linking Cyrillic with Latin, when people think "Ah, it's so like Latin, so I can learn only characters that differ!" It's a very counterproductive way of learning the alphabet, and if it's indeed the case you shouldn't do it this way. Better learn it as if it is completely different one.

[nadyezhda.livejournal.com]

Please note that three years of language study is not likely to result in fluency. Claiming trilingualness might upset some apple carts in various language communities. ;)

That being said, I'm not sure why cyrillic is causing you such problems. Perhaps it's because of the closeness with the latin script? I recommend practice reading, just like with Japanese. What worked for you then? I loved writing stupid little sentences in hiragana and then the same in katakana until I had that down. You can do that in cyrillic, too. It doesn't have to be Russian, just practice matching letters with sounds...

[yukinoitazuchi.livejournal.com]

Please note that three years of language study is not likely to result in fluency.

I've studied for eight years. Fluency is a hard word to define. I'll put a note in my message. I did not mean to offend you or anyone. I am deeply sorry if I did. =(

[nadyezhda.livejournal.com]

No offense taken.

[kenosis.livejournal.com]

Study more. The letters are the least difficult part of Russian. Look around at the letters the frat boys wear around IU and it may go easier, as the Greek letters are (sometimes) similar to those used in Russian.

(Also, I don't mean to be cruel ... but claiming fluency with your comma usage may be relaxing the definition of fluency somewhat.)

[yukinoitazuchi.livejournal.com]

Also, I don't mean to be cruel ... but claiming fluency with your comma usage may be relaxing the definition of fluency somewhat.)

I have always had trouble with commas and semicolons. I am sorry to upset you that you had to compose a comment.

[kenosis.livejournal.com]

It's my fault. I'm sorry - I was having a bad day when I wrote that and I hope you can forgive me.

[belacane.livejournal.com]

i'd say punctuation is quite seperate from the ability to claim fluent competancy in a language... especially spoken fluency.

[botanik1.livejournal.com]

And what about spelling? :-)

[belacane.livejournal.com]

I'm of the personal opinion that as long as the words are recognizable, and the meaning understandable, it's not a huge problem.... and really has little to do with fluency (unless of course the mistakes are so glaringly bad that the whole meaning of the sentence is lost).

Fluency involves more than just being able to write well. It also includes speaking ability, listening ability and reading ability.
One can be fluent in a language and at the same time not be a very good writer.

When it comes to professionalism however, of course spelling, punctuation and grammar are all important.
Lucky for those of us with computers, we now have automated programs which help us with this, so it shouldn't be much of an issue anyways.

[oryx_and_crake]

Maybe this alphabet poem (by Boris Zahoder) will help if you memorize it

Тридцать три родных сестрицы,
Писаных красавицы,
На одной живут странице,
А повсюду славятся!

К вам они сейчас спешат,
Славные сестрицы,
Очень просим всех ребят
С ними подружиться!

А, Бэ, Вэ, Гэ, Дэ, Е, Жэ —
Прикатили на еже.
Зэ, И, Ка, эЛь, эМ, эН, О —
Дружно вылезли в окно.

Пэ, эР, эС, Тэ, У, эФ, Ха —
Оседлали петуха.
Цэ, Чэ, Ша, Ща, Э, Ю, Я —
Вот и все они, друзья.

Познакомьтесь с ними, дети:
Вот они стоят рядком.
Очень плохо жить на свете
Тем, кто с ними не знаком.

[nadyezhda.livejournal.com]

that's really cute. :)

[russiandude.livejournal.com]

A minor note, but one that may explain your difficulty. It is easier for a person to learn things when they are younger. Picking up a language when you are 10 or so is Much easier than when you are 18. It's just the way our brains work.

Thus, it is unsurprising that you did not experience the same frustration with Japanese that you do now. Things might take longer now than they did before, but trilingual fluency is not out of your reach.

Keep on trying with the suggestions other people have given and feel free to check out this community's archives for more russian learning tips. And if you have other problems or questions that you have not found answers to feel free to ask.

[madrumos.livejournal.com]

Although I didn't study it intently, I took a look at that grad program link, and I'm not sure. All I know is, most PhD (and maybe MA) grad programs require fluency in the language of study (Japanese in your case) and then reading knowledge in German or French. This is pretty standard. For instance, UW-Madison's Slavic department requires proficiency in Russian, another Slavic language, and reading proficiency in German or French in order to receive a PhD. I don't know about IU, but it seems that trilingualism is a strange and somewhat inhibitive policy.
And then again, why go to grad school right away! Go to Japan or Russia or something. That's my two cents.

[belacane.livejournal.com]

re: learning to read cyrillic on your own.

Before I started studying russian in class, i tried to teach myself the alphabet, and failed miserably. However, when I started class, I learned the alphabet with no problem in all of an hour or two (give or take a few days =p).

The cyrilic alphabet is insanely simple, although the script can be a bit confusing. I'd say try taking a class, and then judge yourself on your ability to grasp it. I think the context of a class, and the 'deadline' of having to learn it in a certain period of time really helps.

[nyessax.livejournal.com]

The first time I tried to learn Cyrillic, I was on my own and I didn't get it. The second time was in a class, and in class we spent a few days seeing, saying aloud, and writing (in that order for each word) a series of simple words. For homework, we had to write lines of each letter, repeating the sound out loud each time we wrote it. There were other assignments to help us learn Cyrillic, but these are what really worked for me.

[yukinoitazuchi.livejournal.com]

The link for "the holden" does not work. Perhaps I can rethink it and maybe take Korean or just go to Ohio State.

[shrewreader.livejournal.com]

owner of the referred to LJ has requested deletion for reasons of RL separation; Email me offlist if you wish to follow up on any comments you saw here, folks.

[kragoth.livejournal.com]

Hmm...did you have difficulty with learning the english alphabet? It gets easier.

[swiggett.livejournal.com]

Do you know about IU's summer intensive language school? It is probably too late to apply for this summer [but you can always try!] They have 4 and 8 week programs [8 weeks are the only ones to get funding through the program], in many Slavic languages. Off the top of my head, they may also include some Eurasian ones, and one of my friends is going this summer for Romanian. They have many many levels of Russian, so, if you are able to apply now, you may be able to start there this summer, or take classes in the fall, and then continue next summer.

Middlebury College in Vermont has a similar program.

Good luck!

[belacane.livejournal.com]

Beloit College's Center for Language Studies (http://www.summerlanguages.com) is also highly respected, and highly recommended.

[swiggett.livejournal.com]

Yes, thanks, I had forgotten about that, and my sister did her undergraduate there!

[belacane.livejournal.com]

it's very good for languages.... espeically russian.
I think it's one of their strongest departments.