(no subject)

[jasontheknight.livejournal.com]

Hello

As an English speaker, I have a lot of trouble with the Russian rolled "R", or "alveolar trill" as I believe it's called. Back in the old days I just did the French "RRRR" at the back of my throat, but that sounds terrible. I can do a single roll at the front of my mouth (kind of like saying "td" really quickly), but I can't get it to actually roll.

Does anyone have any tales about how they managed to master the rolling R?
Cheers!

Comments

[b0bb.livejournal.com]

There is a special tongue exercise used by the Russian speech therapists for making the (usually) kids start pronouncing "R" correctly - there is a noticeable number of people in Russia who can't do that naturally.

I don't know the details of that exercize, but it involves prononcing "simple" sounds with some interfering object in your mouth, which makes you gradually and completely unconsciously switch to the correct "R" pronunciation.

I think you should look in that direction.

[defying-elphaba.livejournal.com]

Oh, when I was little I had to go to a speech therapist for that. She made me say my R's with either a spoon or a pacifier in my mouth...

[mad-pig.livejournal.com]

I don't know how I was able to manage it, and I too wanted to pronounce the letter "French style" (I took French in high school). I also have a wide tongue that doesn't really have much tip to it, and a slight speech impediment that goes with it.

I guess it was a lot of practice. I just tapped it at first, then got to producing some Czech Ř-like fricative, then I got it right.

Except now I want to pronounce R in every language as a trill, so if I ever master any language and visit the place where it's spoken, they'll think I'm Scottish. But it feels good just to pronounce it.

[yukinoitazuchi.livejournal.com]

Interesting, everyone. =)

[branwen.livejournal.com]

I just practiced over and over! ^.^

[b0bb.livejournal.com]

... and probably still do this not completely correct :)

[branwen.livejournal.com]

Just like my boyfriend will never pronounce words in English completely correctly! ^.^

[b0bb.livejournal.com]

Absolutely.
Is your boyfriend a native English speaker, btw? :)

[branwen.livejournal.com]

No--he is from Uzbekistan, and his native language is Russian.
Hence the reason I'm learning Russian!

[khathi.livejournal.com]

Well, most of the russians learn to pronounce this sound when they are still kids. But it's indeed not very easy, and needs copious amount of time and practice to master -- kids usually start to do it right at 5-7 years, and if not, then they have to practice with speech therapist.
So it's just a matter of effort. ^_^ You should just put tip of your tongue at the alveols, leaving some gap, and put the air through it. If said tip has right position and elasticity, it will vibrate itself, making the sound.

[swiggett.livejournal.com]

I've always been able to roll my Rs... My best description of what's going on inside my mouth is: my tongue is in the same position as it is for a "t" or "d" ... where the teeth meet the soft palate; it just makes contact, do not hold it too firmly in place. As you are saying "aarr" or "rah," try to force all the air over the tip of your tongue where it touches the soft palate/teeth.
I'm also a native English speaker, so it is possible! I haven't really heard any critique on it's pronunciation. Good luck, and I hope this helps.

[mooose.livejournal.com]

I practised how to do the alveolor trill by placing my tongue behind the alveolar ridge (between the teeth and the soft palate), and having it lightly touch the ridge without pressing against on it, then giving a good long sigh.

Although the first time I managed to do it, I think I was quite cold, and I let out a brrrrrrrrrrr. My tongue just so happened to be in the right place for the trill. I didn't get it again for a while though.

[steppinrazor.livejournal.com]

I try that, and just end up drooling all over myself >.<

I think I got it right, -once-. XD

[specialkatsc.livejournal.com]

I never really had a problem with it but I've heard that people who have trouble practice purring like a cat and then just move it back into their mouths... I hope maybe that will help.

[cheytobot.livejournal.com]

mmm, for me, when somebody say "shut up" quick enough, it sounds like a "sharap" with a right russian R. :)

[tisoi.livejournal.com]

Americans pronounce this consonant and they don't even know it. If you're like most Americans, the words "latter" and "ladder" have the same pronunciation. The consonant in the middle is similar to the one found in Russian. I use this strategy to help people pronounce one of the Spanish r's.

[tisoi.livejournal.com]

Oh, darnit. You're British.

No, I don't mean that in a bad way. ;-)

[onodera.livejournal.com]

http://www.anriintern.com/rus/logoped/p.html
If you can conquer the language of this site, you can find out how hard it is to teach a Russian r to a kid.
I myself learned it out of sheer competitiveness when I was around three.

[b0bb.livejournal.com]

"I need to remind you that the working language of this community is English. If you provide any links to the Russian-language web sites, you must provide the translation" Oryx_and_Volk_Off, Moderator

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

Please kindly stop this b****.

[people2005.livejournal.com]

we,russian,pronounse R like a mexican people pronounse R,no difference :)

[misshallelujah.livejournal.com]

I don't have any tips for you except 'practise, practise, practise'! I had to learn how to roll 'r's the hard and fast way, because I learnt Croatian before tackling Russian, and in Croatian the letter 'r' is a vowel. Trying to speak a language peppered with words like "trg" and "prtljag" kinda forces your hand, pretty much.

By the way, I'm native Southeast Asian, and the local English accent here often doesn't differentiate between 'l' and 'r', so you can imagine how hard that was for me. XD

[soonts.livejournal.com]

Man you wont beleive me but some Russians (like me) have the same problem. However, when I was a kid I managed to pronounce French-style "RRR" so that is sounds just like Russian rolled "R"..