(no subject)

[wolfie-18.livejournal.com]

Numbers are driving me INSANE. Recap:

Я встретил двух хороших мальчиков.
Я дал четырём красивых девушек книгу.

If these two sentences are correct, I will be extremely happy.

Comments

[lifetraveller.livejournal.com]

я дал четырем красивым девушкам книгу

[lifetraveller.livejournal.com]

девушкам

[orloffm.livejournal.com]

Я дал кому? девушкам
Девушкам каким? красивым
Девушкам скольким? четырём

[mricon.livejournal.com]

So quit bragging already. :)

[orloffm.livejournal.com]

I'm not. Just trying to help somehow.

[mricon.livejournal.com]

I was trying to make a joke. It seems I have failed. :)

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

The 1st is correct.
The 2nd isn't. Я дал четырём красивым девушкам книгу.

BTW how did you manage to give ONE book to FOUR pretty gils? ;-)))))))))

[wolfie-18.livejournal.com]

I'm cheap like that :p

Oy, vey! I just thought after any number 2-4, the adjectives and the nouns became genetive.

My book makes things complicated... it's hurting my brain.

[ex-ex-zhuzh.livejournal.com]

Your book is correct, but only if entire noun phrase is in the nominative (or, for inanimate nouns, in the accusative).

Два хороших мальчика пошли гулять.
Я вижу три старых дома. (Но: трёх старых мужчин.)
Из метро вышли четыре красивых девушки. (Note that many native speakers would say "четыре красивые девушки" here, which is not entirely correct.)

Notice the apparent lack of agreement in number between nouns and adjectives: nouns are singular but adjectives are plural. These are really vestiges of the old dual grammatical number.

In indirect cases the situation is different:

Двум хорошим мальчикам подарили велосипеды.
Они жили в трёх старых домах.
Я увлечён четырьмя красивыми девушками.

Notice that adjectives and nouns are now both plural, and everything follows the case of the entire noun phrase. Easy! (just kidding)

Well, I hope I've got everything correct! See? native speakers are not always comfortable with numbers either!

[wolfie-18.livejournal.com]

-(Note that many native speakers would say "четыре красивые девушки" here, which is not entirely correct.)

Yeah, my book accounts for that. "adjectives for masculine and neuter nouns are always in the genitive plural, whereas adjectives for feminine nouns may also be in the nominative plural

У меня две младших/младшие сестры."

[nemica.livejournal.com]

BTW how did you manage to give ONE book to FOUR pretty gils? ;-)))))))))

It was my first and maybe the only thought after reading the sentences. :)

[wolfie-18.livejournal.com]

Would it be okay to say "Я дал четырём красивым девушкам по книге" or is по + dative reserved only for sentence constructions using каждый?

[oryx_and_crake]

Yes, this is correct (if you mean that each of four girls got a book )

[wolfie-18.livejournal.com]

How would one translate that into English? "I gave four girls books?" I mean, without using the word "each."

[oryx_and_crake]

No idea - any phrase I can think of looks too complicated, e.g. "I distributed four books among four girls"

[dr-s.livejournal.com]

How would one translate that into English? "I gave four girls books?" I mean, without using the word "each."

Я раздал книги четырём девушкам.
or
Я выдал книги четырём девушкам.

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

Did you notice that the question was how to translate it into ENGLISH? :))))))

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

Absolutely. You got it :)

Almost OFFtopic

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

Четырём is nothing. Even native speakers go nuts if it comes to something like "я должен проверить сведения о ста сорока четырёх тысячах восьмиста шестидесяти девяти девушках" :))))))

Re: Almost OFFtopic

[mricon.livejournal.com]

"Проверить сведения," huh? :)

Re: Almost OFFtopic

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

OK, напечатать портреты восьмисот шестидесяти восьми тысяч четырёхсот девяноста двух девушек :))) (to print out the portraits of eight hundred sixty-eight thousand four hundred and ninety-two girls)

Re: Almost OFFtopic

[oryx_and_crake]

what's wrong with "проверить сведения"?

Re: Almost OFFtopic

[mricon.livejournal.com]

Gramatically, nothing, but it has similar connotations to "inspect" or "check out," so I was poking fun at him "checking out several hundred thousand pretty girls." :)

Re: Almost OFFtopic

[oryx_and_crake]

Well, it depends on context, really, i.e. on what exactly he is going to do with/about there girls after he checks on them...

P.S.

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

Sorry, forgot to translate:
"to check the information on one hundred and forty-four thousand eight hundred and sixty-nine girls"

Re: Almost OFFtopic

[kehlen-crow.livejournal.com]

You're absolutely right! Each time I have to write such long numbers down I pause and do it slowly and even double check that.

*remembers german numbers and shudders*

[storm-jack.livejournal.com]

if it's any consolation, I've heard native speakers go a mile out of their way to not conjugate numbers.

[frostflake.livejournal.com]

*decline, not conjugate (sorry, ocd)

As have I; in most languages, it seems, the natives avoid the same things as the students.

[gelishan.livejournal.com]

Or even more things than the students.

[wolfie-18.livejournal.com]

As a native speaker of Spanish who has never touched a Spanish grammar book in his life, I can completely relate to that.

[holyschist.livejournal.com]

It seems not for English -- the Russian students I've talked to all said that articles are the most difficult aspect, and articles are so instinctive to English speakers that most of us can't explain them (unsurprisingly, since indefinite/definite in English is kind of nonsensical as far as I can tell).

[frostflake.livejournal.com]

hmm In that case, I suppose one could say that both native and non-native English speakers get tripped up by articles, in one way or another. I entirely agree about the nonsense of definite/indefinite in English; one of the best parts of learning other languages is the moment you realise just how strange your own is.

[holyschist.livejournal.com]

Really! I just got back from Russia, and now every time I say something idiomatic in English (and wow, colloquial American English is REALLY idiomatic), my brain trips over it.