(no subject)

[wolfie-18.livejournal.com]

I have just a few clarifications to be made about superlatives.

If I want to express something that is -er, but it's in a case, would I have to use более? Ex: Дети играют перед более новым домом. as opposed to Дети играют перед новее домом.

And to translate the following sentence: The newest cars are the most expensive. = Новейшие машины самые дорогие?

And I just don't know how to say "better looking." This exercise goes: "Он (better looking) чем другие."

And another curious question on etymology. Where do the following two indeclinable words come from: пальто и кино? I'm just guessing that any indeclinable word comes from another root other than Russian.

Comments

[oryx_and_crake]

It will be Дети играют перед более новым домом. as opposed to Дети играют перед тем домом, который поновее. Both are grammatically correct, but the first one sounds more "official", I would choose the second for everyday use.

The newest cars are the most expensive. = Новейшие машины самые дорогие?
This one looks OK. You can also say Самые новые машины - самые дорогие or Самые новые машины - дороже всех.

"Он (better looking) чем другие."
Он красивее других
Он симпатичнее других (please do not confuse Russian симпатичный with "sympathetic" - Russian word means something like "nice, likeable, good-looking")
Он выглядит лучше других

Пальто comes from French paletot meaning, I think, a coat, and this accounts for it being undeclinable. I am not sure about кино, but it must be short for кинематограф. Other undeclinable words are метро, радио, шоссе. Кофе, кенгуру is both undeclinable and masculine (in spite of -e in the end of кофе which is normally a characteristic of neutral gender).

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

Kino was early 1900s German colloquialism for cinema, and it was acquired into Russian.

[onodera.livejournal.com]

Was? It is now.

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

I said WHEN IT WAS ACQUIRED into Russian. I hope you would not argue that, on the contrary, it still IS acquired into Russian right now :))

Ich spreche ein bischen Deutsch; ich weiss dass Kino das richtige heutes Wort ist, aber was ich gesagt habe ist dass das deutsche Wort nach russische Sprache in die 1900e Jahre gekommen ist.

[oryx_and_crake]

Er... shall I remind that the working language of this community is English? :-)))))))))))

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

(checks up the list of the community maintainers) looks like you shan't, sorry :))

[wolfie-18.livejournal.com]

Oh, шоссе is another one. Where did that one come from?

And thank you for the clarification :)

[oryx_and_crake]

шоссе comes from French chausse - road.

[oryx_and_crake]

And yes, I think you are right that indeclinable words are usually borrowed ones (however, not all borrowed words are indeclinable).

[rooskiyroulette.livejournal.com]

I learned that Марокко was indeclinable the hard way :'(

[oryx_and_crake]

There was a funny rhyme designed for memorising the indeclinable words (mind you, they are all declined in the rhyme, to show you what you should never do.) Try to find all indeclinable words you know.

Как-то рано поутру
С братом сели мы в метру,
И поехали в метре
Фильм смотреть о кенгуре.
Кенгура живет в лесу,
Носит в сумке шимпанзу.
Интересная кина,
Жаль, что кончилась она.

:-)

[oryx_and_crake]

Yes, many places' names and such aren't declined either.

[wolk-off.livejournal.com]

Марокко, Бордо (Bordeaux,) Палермо (Palermo, that's obvious,) Сан-Марино etc. - any foreign toponyms which end with -о.

[cema.livejournal.com]

There is also a word морока which is declinable.

[ekeme-ndiba.livejournal.com]

indeclinable words are usually borrowed ones

Usually? Please give me an example of indeclinable native Russian word.

By the way, I wonder why such words like пальто are indeclinable in Russian, while they are morphologically capable of being declined. In Ukrainian and even in Greek, that has much more strict declension paradigms, пальто/παλτό is declinable. In my opinion, lots of indeclinable words impoverish the language. In particular, I hate the idea of leaving intact Slavic toponyms in -o, which is unfortunately very popular nowadays in colloquial and even formal speech.

[oryx_and_crake]

Well, actually people do decline them sometimes even if they are not supposed to. It is just considered grammatically incorrect. E.g. the folk variant for plural of пальто will be пОльты (sounds very witty to me). And you occasionally hear "в пальте" and "на метре".

[belacane.livejournal.com]

I learned it as such....

if the comparative is modifying a noun, i.e "the bigger house", you use более + the adjective declined normally according to whatever case it takes.

if the superlative is modifying a verb i.e "this house is bigger" (or as someone i know put it, uses the verb to be in it, in any form), then you use the other from of comparative i.e больше, удобнее, краснее.....и.т.д