Short form adjectives

[david-us.livejournal.com]

When telling a girl that she is pretty, which would be more correct?
"Tы очень красивая" or "Ты очень красива"

Are both sentences grammatically correct? If so, is there any differences in their meaning?

Basically, I'm wondering how one knows to use the short form of an adjective and when to use the long form.

I have always been taught that the long form should be used if it is modifying a noun which immediately follows it; for example:
"Ты очень красивая девушка."

Finally, a somewhat unrelated question:

Let's say you are trying to tell a woman that she is very beautiful, but you are still trying to be formal and polite. Which one of the following sentences would be correct?

Вы очень красивая
Вы очень красива
Вы очень красивые
Вы очень красивы

David Emerling
Memphis, TN

Comments

[vic-vega.livejournal.com]

>> "Tы очень красивая" or "Ты очень красива"

No differences

>> Вы очень красивая
>> Вы очень красивы

correct

>> Вы очень красива

wrong

>> Вы очень красивые

only in plural form

[superslayer18.livejournal.com]

I'm not Russian, but my Third Year teacher mentioned on several occasions that the use of short-term adjectives (when optional) is starting to fade out in favor of the long form. This seems a little counterintuitive to me, but he's the one with all the degrees in Russian (and you know, being from Moscow) lol.

That's not to say that it isn't used or that it's wrong, just that if you use the long form there shouldn't be any problem (again, I'm talking about situations where both are acceptable, as opposed to when you HAVE to use one or the other). As a general rule, the short form can only be used as a predicate (which it is in your examples), but the change in meaning varies from word to word (and ranges from no difference to very specific meanings). This particular adjective has no difference in meaning between the two forms, but don't take that as the rule. For example, больный и болен mean different things. The latter refers to the temporary state of being sick with the former is describing someone as being sickly or in a constant state of illness.

Russkies please correct me if I said anything in error.

[david-us.livejournal.com]

Just curious, where do you go to school? What are you majoring in?

[superslayer18.livejournal.com]

I go to Yale, and I'm majoring in Political Science and International Studies (with a focus in Russia and China).

[oryx_and_crake]

больный is not a word; it is больнОй

[beowabbit]

I'm not Russian, but my Third Year teacher mentioned on several occasions that the use of short-term adjectives (when optional) is starting to fade out in favor of the long form. This seems a little counterintuitive to me, but he's the one with all the degrees in Russian (and you know, being from Moscow) lol.

It does seem kind of counterintuitive, but short-form adjectives used to be used in lots more situations than they are now (such as attributively, in which case they were declined). They’ve been gradually declining in use in Russian for a very long time, so the expansion of the long-form adjective and the decline in use of the short-form adjective continue a long trend.

I can’t think of any off the top of my head, but there are some stock phrases in Russian that use declined short-form adjectives, and some adverbs that derive from oblique cases of short-form adjectives. And some other Slavic languages still make more extensive use of short adjectives.

(I studied Russian at Yale, too — but two decades ago. What building is the Russian department in now? I bet nobody I took classes from is still there.)

[the-oldest.livejournal.com]

Not "больнЫй" but "больнОй".

[abriter.livejournal.com]

the second variant _usually_ relates to the time as we speak, for example, the girl has just put on a very nice dress, and you say, wow, ты очень красивая in this dress.

but the second was "очень красивА". we were taught the same, just..vice versa: the long form refers to a constant quality (ты очень красивая = ты _всегда_ очень красивая) and the short form is for the time we speak: "ты очень красива сегодня!".

Here (http://www.rusgram.narod.ru/1315-1341.html, §1330) they write the same... But the short form is preferred in that situation, so i guess you can use the long one as well.

[vakhitov.livejournal.com]

Basically, the second variant is kinda more poetic.

+1

[abriter.livejournal.com]

:))мы это совсем недавно в универе проходили, поэтому запомнилось.

[superslayer18.livejournal.com]

The Slavic dept. is in one of the entryways of the Hall of Graduate Studies now. You might know.... I think her name is Emilia Hermova or something? I'm not sure how long everyone else has been there for, though I'm sure it's up on the site (yale.edu/slavic i think)

[ulvesang.livejournal.com]

i was wondering if you knew of any publications that describe the decline of short forms?