Impersonal expressions

[tricours.livejournal.com]

I'm having a bit of trouble with formulating impersonal expressions in Russian. I know you're supposed to use the third person plural of the verb, but how would you say things of this kind:

"When you see the beautiful houses of others, you feel like such a failure"
"If someone asks you for help, you can only do your best"

Thanks in advance :)

Comments

[oryx_and_crake]

You can use a construction similar to English:
"когда видишь... чувствуешь себя..."
"когда тебя просят о помощи, старайся..." etc.

[cassandraclue.livejournal.com]

is it better to use ты if you're talking generally, rather than вы?

[oryx_and_crake]

yes
sometimes it is the only option, e.g. in "что тут поделаешь?!" - "What can one do!"

[adri-nwnderland.livejournal.com]

когда во круг красивые доми другуx, чустьвуешь себе не достатные (или не успешно)

2. Если тебя просить помочь , только подавать руку по своему миру. (по своей возможности)

So wait for someone to correct my grammar there, but the main idea in the first was to say 'not enough'. I've never heard anyone say failure, and it seems like an extreme statement in Russian.

The idea in the second is of course that third person, but beyond that I'm not sure...

[freedomcry.livejournal.com]

I've never heard anyone say failure, and it seems like an extreme statement in Russian.

Nah. «Чувствуешь себя неудачником» doesn't sound all that extreme to me.

[adri-nwnderland.livejournal.com]

oh man,
that prosit' should be in third person and the pomoch' in genetive.

[adri-nwnderland.livejournal.com]

mmm, maybe just failure sounds more extreme than 'unlucky guy'.
It's those little linguistic tricks, like how we say 'thanks' all the time but we don't really mean 'spasibo' every time. Or, how we say 'normal' and mean not 'normalno' but average. Thank god I'm not a translator.

[freedomcry.livejournal.com]

"Неудачник" is more of a "loser" than "unlucky guy", really. The etymology doesn't always convey the connotation.

[freedomcry.livejournal.com]

The impersonal "you" is better conveyed by an impersonal "you" (singular). The 3rd person plural is most often the equivalent of an English passive voice.

[ra-family.livejournal.com]

1. Когда ты видишь красивые дома других, ты чувствуешь себя неудачником.
2. Если кто-то просит тебя о помощи, ты можешь постараться изо всех сил.

Speaking about your variants.
1. Когда вокруг красивые домА других, чувствуешь себЯ недостаточнЫМ (неуспешнЫМ).
2. Если тебя просЯТ О помощи, the second part is incoorect not only in grammar but it has no meaning in Russian.
As for "not enough", it's better to say неусрешный. But to failure неудачник is more close.
That third person in Russian is replaced by "кто-то"= somebody.

[2007april.livejournal.com]

Видя (наблюдая) чьи-то прекрасные дома, чувствуешь себя неудачником.
Помогая другому, делай это наилучшим образом. Or: Когда тебя просят о помощи, делай всё от тебя зависящее.

[zauberer.livejournal.com]

Strictly speaking, there are several kinds of expressiona where the subject is not really defined. Your first example could be translated to "Глядя на чужие красивые дома, чувствуешь себя таким неудачником". This is a so called "generalized-person statement" (обобщённо-личное предложение), because it describes through 2nd pers. sg. something that could be experienced by any subject (i.e. generalized).

Your second example could be translated to "Если тебя попросят о помощи,..." This is an example of "non defined person", because the grammatical person of the subject does not really matter to convey the meaning (i.e. anybody could ask: I, you, he, they, etc).

There are two more classes of such statements: "defined person", like "люблю грозу в начале мая" (the person of subject is clearly implied, although the subject is omitted) and true impersonal statements like "Вечерело" (no person can be implied at all).

[malim-praedari.livejournal.com]

+1

[archaicos.livejournal.com]

or что тут поделать? (infinitive, no persons involved)

[oryx_and_crake]

Well, that does not help. I am sorry to say that but both your phrases are grammatically wrong and the second one is not even understandable.

[oryx_and_crake]

You don't say недостаточный about a person, this makes no sense. You can say that some resources or efforts were insufficient but you cannot talk about an insufficient person.